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Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:07 pm
by Bird on a Fire
jimbob wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 7:45 pm
Bird on a Fire wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:12 pm
plodder wrote: Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:24 am
Big changes in farming. The ban on Neonicotinoid pesticides will be lifted. I'm pretty uncomfortable about this one. Similarly GM, where I'm a bit more relaxed.
Looking medium-term, most farming isn't going to be sustainable without EU subsidies and cheap imported labour, and I don't see the Tories replacing either.
So we'll be seeing land abandonment on a massive scale. Obviously rural communities will need a huge amount of support, but in terms of land use it's a huge opportunity for catchment-scale river restoration, peatland restoration (something like 25x more effective as a carbon sink than forest), maybe even a couple of rewilded landscapes (perhaps a National Park or two could be appropriated for conservation/carbon purposes, for example). Plus all those extra trees we need will plant themselves given a few years without ploughing.
Creating cool, interesting bits of countryside with recreational jobs might be the best solution for farming communities anyway. Eagles are huge business in places like Mull - much more profitable than sheep, especially when you factor in that most upland farming is entirely dependent on public money.
As an aside my daughter (geography degree) and my brother (ecologist) have been talking about the Knepp Estate rewilding on WhatsApp, along with some of Dad's former colleagues.
My brother's view is that it would have been better to try to emulate a 17th Century farming regime rather than rewilding as a lot of farms will end up being uneconomic, and recreate lots of the habitats that it's creating anyway, whilst the 17th Century farming regime would create habitats that are now more rare. He says that the ecological impact reports also suggest this.
Hmmmm. Knepp is using heritage breeds of livestock rather than the attempts to "breed back" e.g. aurochs. Low-density grazing and wood pasture very much is traditional farming practice - a lot of commons would have looked like Knepp before enclosure, for instance. I don't think they even use the "rewilding" label to describe what they do.
In any case, abandoned farms won't create Knepp-style habitats without the reintroduction of boar and various grazers, unless current farming stock are just allowed to go feral and wander off, which I think is unlikely.
The big value of Knepp has been a concrete demonstration of what's possible on UK soil, as policymakers were unconvinced by reasoned arguments and demonstrations in places like the Netherlands. The fact that beaver reintroduction is looking hugely likely probably owes a fair bit to Knepp, for instance, even though they haven't actually got any beavers - because they've changed how people think about "rewilding".
It's possible that in a hypothetical future with large-scale farm abandonment and herbivore reintroductions that Knepp-style habitats would become common, and that running a heritage farm would create rarer habitats. But there's plenty of old-fashioned model farms in the UK already, so it wouldn't generate as much interest or attention right now when we need the debate to advance.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:07 pm
by dyqik
DB Schenker, the biggest shipping firm into the UK, is now refusing shipments to the UK, because 90% of them have incomplete paperwork that means delays.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:19 pm
by lpm
The key is we've got our fish back. They are now British fish, and they are better and happier fish for it.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:27 pm
by sTeamTraen
bmforre wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 12:29 am
shpalman wrote: Mon Jan 11, 2021 10:25 pm
From a committed Brexit Party supporter
"What annoys me is that while we are having to put up with food shortages and disruptions at our ports the EU is not having any problems, how is that fair?"
Remember that THEY need the UK more than the UK needs them.
I have that from authoritative sources.
Y'all know that archer_rs is a spoof account, right? He came to fame in the summer with a scarcely-believable (because fictional) tale of how his Brexit-voting neighbour in France was getting up to all sorts of high jinks, complete with amusing portrayal of mildly-corrupt-in-a-loveable-way French officials and neighbour's idiot son. Then he got called out as the story became more and more implausible and he blocked a few of the people doing the calling out, including me. I read his stuff from another browser window - it's sometimes quite funny but it's really just the Titania McGrath of Remain.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2021 2:40 pm
by Brightonian
A Polish trucker's experience in Kent. Similar probably happening to others, doubt some will return.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Sat Jan 16, 2021 3:43 pm
by Zelot
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:37 am
by veravista
Article in the FT, usual link to get around - 'British business travellers face a bewildering return to the EU'
Business meeting in Europe? Apply for a work permit depending on which country you're going too and demonstrate economic need. It's what we voted for....
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:01 pm
by Brightonian
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:27 pm
by monkey
You need to do it on a hill, otherwise chasing it is a bit boring.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:03 am
by Aoui
I think all those Brexit tw.ts should answer for our lack of good British cheese over here in the EU. I bought the last double Gloucester in the expat shop last week. I have one piece of medium cheddar and one half chunk of red leicester. These are not large hunks of cheese. Gouda is fine for a lot of stuff, but sometimes you just need British cheese. Ireland does export some cheddar, but that's about it and they are going to have to scale up quickly. I feel badly for the people who didn't vote for Brexit, but the Brexiteers..may they rot in the hell of their own making....
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:36 am
by Little waster
Aoui wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:03 am
I think all those Brexit tw.ts should answer for our lack of good British cheese over here in the EU. I bought the last double Gloucester in the expat shop last week. I have one piece of medium cheddar and one half chunk of red leicester. These are not large hunks of cheese. Gouda is fine for a lot of stuff, but sometimes you just need British cheese. Ireland does export some cheddar, but that's about it and they are going to have to scale up quickly. I feel badly for the people who didn't vote for Brexit, but the Brexiteers..may they rot in the hell of their own making....
Still ... Blue Stilton.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:41 pm
by Martin_B
Aoui wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:03 am
... Ireland does export some cheddar, but that's about it and they are going to have to scale up quickly. ....
You can't scale up Cheddar production that quickly - doesn't it have to mature for a minimum of 3 months to be called Cheddar? And even so that's piss-weak Cheddar; the proper stuff is at least 18 months matured, and more like 2-3 years.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:00 pm
by veravista
Doesn't matter because soon you'll be able to get Albanian cheddar as the title won't be covered by EU protection anymore...
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:25 pm
by dyqik
Aoui wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:03 am
I think all those Brexit tw.ts should answer for our lack of good British cheese over here in the EU. I bought the last double Gloucester in the expat shop last week. I have one piece of medium cheddar and one half chunk of red leicester. These are not large hunks of cheese. Gouda is fine for a lot of stuff, but sometimes you just need British cheese. Ireland does export some cheddar, but that's about it and they are going to have to scale up quickly. I feel badly for the people who didn't vote for Brexit, but the Brexiteers..may they rot in the hell of their own making....
Thoughts and prayers from this US person
We can get some English cheeses here - Colliers and Somerfield are fairly available. Other non-US style cheddars available are Kerrygold (Irish) or Old Croc (Aussie).
Fortunately up at this end of the country, we can get Cabot clothbound cave-aged cheddar fairly easily, which is probably a better example than the Somerfield ones.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:26 pm
by Gfamily
veravista wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:00 pm
Doesn't matter because soon you'll be able to get Albanian cheddar as the title won't be covered by EU protection anymore...
Not that it's currently protected (apart from "West Country Cheddar") - so unless the cheddar makers in
Vlorë think "we're in the South West, it'll be fine", it'll probably not be an issue.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:27 pm
by Nero
Bugger, I might need to grow a beard.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 4:30 pm
by Trinucleus
veravista wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:00 pm
Doesn't matter because soon you'll be able to get Albanian cheddar as the title won't be covered by EU protection anymore...
When I were a lad in the sixties, you could get New Zealand cheddar (mild) and Canadian cheddar (strong). Isn't that what the Brexiteers promised us we'd go back to?
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 5:05 pm
by Bird on a Fire
Trinucleus wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 4:30 pm
veravista wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:00 pm
Doesn't matter because soon you'll be able to get Albanian cheddar as the title won't be covered by EU protection anymore...
When I were a lad in the sixties, you could get New Zealand cheddar (mild) and Canadian cheddar (strong). Isn't that what the Brexiteers promised us we'd go back to?
Not to mention USian cheddar (orange), for those who haven't yet had their fill of unpalatable orange travesties from the US.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 8:03 am
by Brightonian
Good article in the FT: "How the Brexit deal was done — and what happens next", mainly about the negotiations last year under Johnson.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:23 am
by plodder
dyqik wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:25 pm
Thoughts and prayers from this US person
We can get some English cheeses here - Colliers and Somerfield are fairly available. Other non-US style cheddars available are Kerrygold (Irish) or Old Croc (Aussie).
Fortunately up at this end of the country, we can get Cabot clothbound cave-aged cheddar fairly easily, which is probably a better example than the Somerfield ones.
Some famous and well regarded English cheeses there...
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:52 am
by bmforre
I heard on BBC news that
Nissan now consider UK location competitive:
"It has created a competitive environment for Sunderland, not just inside the UK but outside as well.
"We've decided to localise the manufacture of the 62kWh battery in Sunderland so that all our products qualify [for tariff-free export to the EU]. We are committed to Sunderland for the long term under the business conditions that have been agreed."
Sounds rather better than what had been feared?
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:08 am
by plodder
bmforre wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:52 am
I heard on BBC news that
Nissan now consider UK location competitive:
"It has created a competitive environment for Sunderland, not just inside the UK but outside as well.
"We've decided to localise the manufacture of the 62kWh battery in Sunderland so that all our products qualify [for tariff-free export to the EU]. We are committed to Sunderland for the long term under the business conditions that have been agreed."
Sounds rather better than what had been feared?
Is this to do with the 11 free ports that are proposed?
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:22 pm
by dyqik
plodder wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:23 am
dyqik wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:25 pm
Thoughts and prayers from this US person
We can get some English cheeses here - Colliers and Somerfield are fairly available. Other non-US style cheddars available are Kerrygold (Irish) or Old Croc (Aussie).
Fortunately up at this end of the country, we can get Cabot clothbound cave-aged cheddar fairly easily, which is probably a better example than the Somerfield ones.
Some famous and well regarded English cheeses there...
Sometimes we can even get that wensleydale with apricots in, and sage Derby.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:26 pm
by Little waster
dyqik wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:22 pm
wensleydale with apricots in
HERESY!
Re: Brexit Consequences
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:22 pm
by Opti
Little waster wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:26 pm
dyqik wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:22 pm
wensleydale with apricots in
HERESY!
Who the actual f.ck thought of putting fruit
in cheese? And why?
I mean fruit
and cheese is perfectly normal.