Anti-semitic pogroms in Europe in 2024

[bjn]

FWIW I expect Israel to be banned from the competition... given Russia is banned and the UN has yet to determine whether it committed genocide in Ukraine, whereas the UN has already determined Israel has committed genocide in Gaza.

Which begs the question, should teams from countries persuing genocidal policies be allowed to play in the UK?

[headshot]

FWIW I expect Israel to be banned from the competition... given Russia is banned and the UN has yet to determine whether it committed genocide in Ukraine, whereas the UN has already determined Israel has committed genocide in Gaza.

Which begs the question, should teams from countries persuing genocidal policies be allowed to play in the UK?

FIFA banned Russia after Ukraine.

FIFA has not banned Israel despite the UN concluding that they’ve committed genocide.

So there’s that.

Though that’s probably not the reason the WMP have banned the fans. It’s probably because they incited violence in Amsterdam.

The reaction to that violence in Amsterdam was equally abhorrent, but surely no-one can argue that the Maccabi fans were the victims here.

Would the violence towards Jewish communities in Amsterdam have happened if Maccabi fans hadn’t turned up and kicked things off? Perhaps. Maybe there was a section of society looking for a reason to attack Jews.

The Maccabi fans’ actions made things much worse for the local Jewish communities.

Perhaps WMP had intelligence of Maccabi fans planning trouble and were worried about an escalation. Sure, multiple parties would be to blame, but sometimes the best way to prevent a fire is to remove the catalyst.

[Grumble]

The Maccabi fans being Jewish is tied up with their hooliganism, but the main problem is the hooliganism. I don’t think Protestants or Unionists are a problem because of the antics (largely in the past I think) of Rangers fans.

[Tristan]

Though that’s probably not the reason the WMP have banned the fans. It’s probably because they incited violence in Amsterdam.

The reaction to that violence in Amsterdam was equally abhorrent, but surely no-one can argue that the Maccabi fans were the victims here.

Would the violence towards Jewish communities in Amsterdam have happened if Maccabi fans hadn’t turned up and kicked things off? Perhaps. Maybe there was a section of society looking for a reason to attack Jews.

The Maccabi fans’ actions made things much worse for the local Jewish communities.

Perhaps WMP had intelligence of Maccabi fans planning trouble and were worried about an escalation. Sure, multiple parties would be to blame, but sometimes the best way to prevent a fire is to remove the catalyst.

As I said before, I imagine you wouldn't dream of writing about it in those terms if something like the below happened:

With all the St George's crosses that have been going up I wonder how people would have reacted in the following scenario:
- A group of Asian guys goes around a town taking down some of the St George's crosses and burning them, offensively chanting as they do
- A white cabbie shouts back at them and has his cab attacked
- The local racists start some whatsapp groups and talk about going "P*ki bashing"
- The local racists, helped by local white cabbies, start going around town finding muslims and Asians to beat up
- They conduct multiple hit and run attacks across town and send some of the Asians to hospital.

And with regards to this on the reason for the ban:

Though that’s probably not the reason the WMP have banned the fans. It’s probably because they incited violence in Amsterdam.

There's no evidence that this is probably the reason. It's equally likely that they had intelligence that violence would be directed towards them.

[Grumble]

There's no evidence that this is probably the reason. It's equally likely that they had intelligence that violence would be directed towards them.

Don’t be silly Tristan, we’ve witnessed Maccabi fans being violent this year. This is not a lingering reputation which you might argue is outdated for England fans, it’s clearly here and now.

[Tristan]

There's no evidence that this is probably the reason. It's equally likely that they had intelligence that violence would be directed towards them.

Don’t be silly Tristan, we’ve witnessed Maccabi fans being violent this year. This is not a lingering reputation which you might argue is outdated for England fans, it’s clearly here and now.

There are many fans out there with violent fans that don't have their fans banned in total. It is equally likely, given what happened in Amsterdam last year, that the risk they saw was in violence towards them, which we saw on a large scale last year.